hisich wrote: People getting money for 'free' (i.e., not earning it) is welfare in my book. I'm surprised that you dishonestly came w/a chart of only discretionary spending.
So the main beneficiaries of government health care are retired people, poor children, and veterans. Who deserves sickness and death and why didn't they earn their existence?
https://www.taxpolicycenter.org/briefing-book/how-much-does-federal-government-spend-health-care
The pension fund is paid to government workers, they did work for it. Social Security was also deducted while working.
hisich wrote: Do you think ignoring the debt problem (primarily due to past promises of 'free' shit) makes it go away...?
Taxing the people who have money is the only way to reduce the deficit even with zero spending (which would tank the economy).
shamangineer wrote: So the main beneficiaries of government health care are retired people, poor children, and veterans. Who deserves sickness and death and why didn't they earn their existence?
https://www.taxpolicycenter.org/briefing-book/how-much-does-federal-government-spend-health-careThe pension fund is paid to government workers, they did work for it. Social Security was also deducted while working.
Taxing the people who have money is the only way to reduce the deficit even with zero spending (which would tank the economy).
STILL no answers to ANY of my 7 Q's...
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hisich wrote: STILL no answers to ANY of my 7 Q's...
No offense hisich, but I feel like trying to explain colours to someone who can only see in black and white is bit futile.. Regarding your answers, I stick to my previous post with the link to the THC Episode with Scott. You'll find most of (if not all) your answers.
Kindly,
EP
enjoypolo wrote: No offense hisich, but I feel like trying to explain colours to someone who can only see in black and white is bit futile.. Regarding your answers, I stick to my previous post with the link to the THC Episode with Scott. You'll find most of (if not all) your answers.
Kindly,
EP
Who would've guessed that 7 simple Q's would be so hard for UBI Utopianists to answer...
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Oh for fucks sake!
hisich wrote: As the Establishment & its political puppets continue promoting the idea of UBI--for surely nefarious reasons--I wonder how all of the self-styled 'rebels' who think they're being anti-Establishment by promoting the Establishment policy of turning us all into children who receive an allowance from the Establishment would answer these Q's:
1. Who is going to administer this program, if not the corrupt Establishment currently in charge?
Part of the beauty of the universal portion of UBI is that it would require little administration. It would in fact be capable of vastly reducing administration costs if it were able to replace welfare and social security, which it should be able to do.
hisich wrote: 2. Are there any limits as to who is allowed to collect this 'free' money, i.e., will a World Ruling Class re-distribute wealth to everyone on Earth, will individual nations do it only for their own citizens, do you dummies think 1st World nations can simply absorb all the billions of poverty-stricken 3rd Worlders into their nations, etc...?
This would be for all citizens. Simple enough?
hisich wrote: 3. What do you propose doing to people who don't want to participate--on either the receiving or giving end?
I doubt many would turn it down. They would still receive a check, but they can give it all to charity or whatever they like. I am pretty sure people who didn't pay taxes would be jailed rather than given a refund. Imagine that.
hisich wrote: 4. Do all of the current unsustainable, failing, severely-underfunded, UBI-ish, bankrupt, something-for-nothing programs that already exist (public & private pensions, economic &medical welfare programs, school/college subsidies, artificial make-work jobs/useless admin, etc.) not give you any pause regarding your even more ambitious "Free Shit For Everyone" utopian fantasies?
I do agree that most administration jobs are BS jobs, another reason for UBI would be reduced paperwork. Who the fuck would want to work a BS job if there were other options. With regard to the rest:
hisich wrote: 5. We put signs up in nature areas telling people not to feed the animals (i.e., give them 'free' stuff), as it will promote dependence & degrade their ability to fend for themselves. Why does the same principle not apply to humans (do all the MILLIONS of people getting 'free' shit now live particularly useful or purposeful lives--go to a housing project & get back to me!)?
Go to the housing project and live on the street for a week with nothing but the clothes on your back and let us know how that goes for you, how did you fend?
hisich wrote: 6. After you ensure everyone can live for 'free', how do you deal w/reproduction...will people be allowed to have as many children as they want or will the Ruling Class act as cattle farmers who direct human reproduction?
Are you fishing for some eugenicist's wet dream or something? Umm, well, not so much. Most industrialized countries are at negative population growth. It seems to me the primary reason that people have more children is insecurity.
hisich wrote: 7. Lastly, since y'all are SO concerned about the poor/needy, I'm sure that you, as pampered 1st World suburbanites surrounded by abundance, ALREADY give significant portions of YOUR OWN incomes to FAR worse off people living in truly impoverished conditions in the 3rd World, yes...?
I personally have not, but I have given directly to homeless people, relatives, volunteered, and given multiple chats for the love of the game. What have you given people other than a shitty attitude?
You're too kind Shamangineer. I wouldn't have had the patience to do it :rolleyes:
*Claps*
I'm guessing it won't be long before I get one of these:
shamangineer wrote:
Part of the beauty of the universal portion of UBI is that it would require little administration. It would in fact be capable of vastly reducing administration costs if it were able to replace welfare and social security, which it should be able to do.
Not an answer.
shamangineer wrote: This would be for all citizens. Simple enough?
So truly destitute people from the 3rd World would be turned back at the border I guess?
shamangineer wrote: I doubt many would turn it down. They would still receive a check, but they can give it all to charity or whatever they like. I am pretty sure people who didn't pay taxes would be jailed rather than given a refund. Imagine that.
So you want to bring back Debtor's Prisons--fantastic!
shamangineer wrote: I do agree that most administration jobs are BS jobs, another reason for UBI would be reduced paperwork. Who the fuck would want to work a BS job if there were other options.
Not an answer.
shamangineer wrote: Go to the housing project and live on the street for a week with nothing but the clothes on your back and let us know how that goes for you, how did you fend?
Not an answer.
shamangineer wrote: Are you fishing for some eugenicist's wet dream or something? Umm, well, not so much. Most industrialized countries are at negative population growth. It seems to me the primary reason that people have more children is insecurity.
Not an answer.
shamangineer wrote: I personally have not, but I have given directly to homeless people, relatives, volunteered, and given multiple chats for the love of the game. What have you given people other than a shitty attitude?
You admit your hypocrisy...I appreciate the honesty. As w/most bleeding-heart types you're only generous w/OPM.
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enjoypolo wrote: You're too kind Shamangineer. I wouldn't have had the patience to do it :rolleyes:
*Claps*
Well, it doesn't take much effort to answer straight-forward Q's...which Shamangineer really didn't even accomplish.
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shamangineer wrote: I'm guessing it won't be long before I get one of these:
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hisich wrote: Well, it doesn't take much effort to answer straight-forward Q's...which Shamangineer really didn't even accomplish.
shamangineer wrote:
You literally support Debtor's Prisons...
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shamangineer wrote:
Promoting UBI & Medicare-for-all in 2019 is about as un-edgy as one can get...
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